I thought this was a local site... no photos or local reporting? This story is on the top of the TV news!

Thanks goodness the residents were not allowed to take down the tree beforehand--so what if someone would have been injured or killed--trees are more important. Thank goodness we have Canopy to make sure that no tree--on private or public property--is ever taken down.

Kudos again to the PAFD, they let everyone responding know that the tree was in power lines and not to go near it.

qq

If a resident wants to cut down a protected tree because they consider it unsafe in a storm and the City refuses to let them remove it. Who is liable if the tree collapse and damages a house or God forbid kills someone?

There are a whole lot of trees down around the city from this storm.

The footbridge between Wilkie Way and Miller Ave is blocked by a fallen tree. (There is a whole lot of yellow tape reading "Police Line Do Not Cross" as well).

Thanks for the warning about the Wilkie bike path. What is the best detour for bicyclists who are trying to get to Mountain View? Maybe Alma Street?

Levi: The closest available choices are Alma Street and El Camino. Which one makes more sense probably depends on where you're starting and where you're trying to go.

Hey Yeah for Canopy, there's no report that the homeowners wanted to take the tree down but couldn't (or that they had chosen not to). Even if Canopy turns out to be a bunch of evil geniuses but still It simply has nothing to do with the story.

Now if you could work in a taliban connection....

Here's another one that would be great with a photo, guys.

Sorry, bad advice was given on alternate bike routes. It is legal but abundantly foolish to bike on either Alma (no room for a bike lane, which forces all passing traffic to go around the cyclist at 40 mph) or El Camino (obviously very complex traffic going 40 mph, many cross streets and driveways, etc.). These routes are asking for trouble!

The alternate routes are convoluted but worth the few extra minutes. One begins with Nelson Dr. off of E. Charleston. Once through the maze to San Antonio, where Alma becomes Central Expressway, turn right to go up the San Antonio frontage to get onto Central where there are good bike lanes.

From Arastradero (near Gunn High) there is a bike path adjacent to the Alta Mesa cemetery that goes behind Terman Park and connects to Los Altos Ave. You still have to go a block or so on El Camino to get to a through street on the other side.

Is there any evidence that the residents had considered the tree to be in potential danger of falling and causing injury/destruction?

It's my understanding that in such a case a tree may be removed.

If this is not the case why would anyone want to take this mini event and "9/11" it into a big blast at "Canopy!". Trees of Mass Destruction!

I used to go to a park in the East Bay (Richmond--Point Pinole) filled with old eucalyptus trees. I was in school and would read/study outside. Every now and then one of them would come crashing down. I guess I should have vociferously complained to the park dept. that each and every tree out there was threatening my life.

Rides 5k - is the "maze" bike route to San Antonio well marked? I.e., is it easy to follow at night without a map?

This publication has been acting odd for a while now. Badly worded sentences, misspells, erroneous info, missing info, no pics.

After this comment, I guess it's time to edit our speech and content now, and lock down this forum to only 'registered users'? I read these posts often during the day and with the exception of a very few posters, see little or no reason why these forums, like the one on school truancy or public decorum, are being randomly, and with no explanation, locked down. Some with access only to registered users, some completely, no access to anyone. Combine that with the City now posting 'rules' on what should be common sense, this is getting worrisome. Palo Alto = Stepford? No ugly comments or pictures of house killing trees to spoil the pretty image?

Levi: The "maze" route is not possible to follow at night without a map or repeatedly traveling the route to learn it. Its also very slow when compared with using Alma Street.

Cycling on Alma works just fine on this stretch if you place yourself far enough from the curb that motorists see that they need to use the next lane over to pass you. If you're headed southbound, this places you just to the left of the flooded section. Northbound, just left of the crack caused by paving over a concrete gutter.

El Camino also works just fine, though you're going to have to wait for a few more traffic lights than on Alma. Depending on where you started, and where you're trying to go, this may be the faster way to get where you're going.

The path near the Alta Mesa cemetery is on the other side of town. It can only make sense as an alternate route if you have a lot of time on your hands, or if the Wilkie-Miller bridge was rather far out of your way to begin with.

The home damaged by the tree belongs to my brother and sister in law. Their daughter had returned home only minutes before that tree fell on their porch and had she still be on the porch, she most likely would have been killed. Sounds like there should be some serious checking out of these old trees in Palo Alto.

Anyone biking on Alma, in the rain, has a death wish. Speeds are too high, lanes are too narrow, and the southbound Oregon merge is a hazard.

Middlefield (although it has dangerous sections) is better if you can. Otherwise, the maze is not bad at all; just look at a map before you go.

It's not worth the risk to bike on Alma in the rain, and I'd stay off El Camino too.

When a big limb of a Palo Alto tree next to my driveway fell on my car and damaged it to the tune of over $1600, the city's insurer would not pay, saying "The City did not cause the tree limb to fall and had no way of knowing that it would fall."...and it was a calm, windless day. Good luck to these people.

Methinks you guys are living a crazed life of fear. A cyclist on Alma is incredibly visible, since the road is straight. There isn't much cross traffic, the main source of car-bike collisions. The narrow lanes mean you need to position yourself so that it is clear to overtaking motorists that they need to use the next lane over. People pass you using the next lane over, about as far away as they would be if you were riding in a bicycle lake, and at a lower speed than on a lot of other roads (eg: foothill or central) besides.

There's a difference between how fearful you feel, and how dangerous a road actually is. The reality is that Alma, while it makes some people quite fearful, isn't particularly hazardous. I see no reason to avoid it when it is the most convenient available route.

For the love of God please don't bike on Alma. I think it's highly dangerous because of detritus from the RR can spread to the street and can cause a cyclist to fall. I've seen it happen! Lived at Alma a very long time. About any given time there are cars swiftly moving making a collision almost guaranteed. Someone in this forum said we motorists should not swerve in to the next lane and should follow the cyclist treating them as another vehicle. No thanks. That's unsafe. For both parties. Sometimes a biker is hidden by another vehicle in the lane. Until a cyclist can go the speed limit why should we slow the flow of traffic for long lengths of road just because the cyclist won't use other routes? There is a reason bikes can't use the freeway, same should apply to Alma. On the RR side, there simply is not room to safely share the road! Use the Alma sidewalk if you absolutely MUST go that route.

Good GOD don't ride your bike on Alma. OR Middlefield for that matter. Do you know how many of us maniac-driving mini-van moms are out there not paying attention to the road because our children are screaming at us in the back seat? We really do try to be good drivers but please, please, please don't put yourselves in danger if there are safe bike routes through the city. They may not be the fastest route but they will keep you alive.

MidtownBiker - can you tell me what streets make up this San Antonio "maze"? I couldn't figure it out from my AAA map. I am trying to get from the Park Blvd. in Palo Alto (near Frys) to Castro Street in Mountain View. I normally take Park Blvd. through Palo Alto, then over Wilkie bridge to California Street in Mountain View.

I see bicyclists on El Camino near San Antonio all the time. I'm sure that many of them would use a lower-traffic direct route if it were better publicized.

Thanks.

FWIW, there's a nice new fence with a fairly fine mesh between Alma and the train. Freak accidents can and do happen, and train debris coming through a fence is very much into the realm of being so unlikely that it isn't worth worrying about.

As to proper passing, yes, you should change lanes before reaching the cyclist, or follow the cyclist until you can safely change lanes. That should be obvious. The reality is that you might see 10 or 15 seconds of delay from somebody whose preferred route is blocked by a fallen tree. Not nearly so much as you're going to get from waiting at traffic lights...

Once again, lack of signage is a problem in Palo Alto. Even when bike routes are in place, it is often very difficult for bicyclists to follow them. The infamous city website has no bike paths map. Some of the school websites do. Additionally, there are no public transit maps of Palo Alto with interacting services.

One reason we have so many bicyclists on unsuitable streets is becauses they often do not know the options. Generally speaking they only know the best way by word of mouth. In this technological age, isn't that a bit archaic?

Mesh does not keep debris from falling into the roadway. Having lived at Alma for many years, sometimes out of curiosity after an accident; in the early morning hours (low traffic) we have taken a high power flashlight and gone out to examine Alma. We have seen rocks, sand, dirt patches,litter, previous accident debris... all potential road hazards more dangerous to bikers than cars. A few years back, before the Homer at Alma transition for the clinic access there was a slime patch up against the RR side by the old pillar that during wet weather even at low speeds would cause motorists to fishtail. Best we could figure (we had a low speed accident there, told some people and found others had too, so we investigated). It's gone now, but other dangers remain all along the entire length of that street.

ySk: that sounds like the rather ordinary debris that's on pretty much any road. If anything, Alma has less such debris than other roads in the area, since passing traffic sweeps it off the road.

Resident - I agree that the bike route system in Palo Alto has lots of room for improvement. I really like the system in San Francisco where all the bike routes are numbered and all the bike route signs show the number and the destination of the bike route. These bike routes are pretty easy to navigate without having to stop at every corner and pull out your map. I have sent this suggestion to the city web site, but got no response. In Palo Alto, destinations that are any distance from Bryant Street can be hard to get to, especially if they involve freeway crossings.

very1silent: As a cyclist, I can attest to the fact that traffic does NOT sweep debris off the road -- it pushes it to the side, which is why Alma is particularly dangerous. On Alma, there is no "wiggle room" if the cyclist is confronted with debris and has to move left into traffic to avoid it. When there is a bike lane you can move left and still avoid traffic. Cycling on Alma at anytime other than early Sunday morning is incredibly risky.

very1silent: As a cyclist, I can attest to the fact that traffic does NOT sweep debris off the road -- it pushes it to the side, which is why Alma is particularly dangerous. On Alma, there is no "wiggle room" if the cyclist is confronted with debris and has to move left into traffic to avoid it. When there is a bike lane you can move left and still avoid traffic. Cycling on Alma at anytime other than early Sunday morning is incredibly risky.

cyclist - can you recommend an alternative bicycle route to get from Park Blvd. in Palo Alto to California St. in Mountain View since the Wilkie bridge is closed? Alma is the closest street on the map, but bicyclists do not appear to be welcome there. Thanks.

Levi: I rode Alma today. Its rainy, so not so many people are cycling, but I saw one other Wilkie bike bridge regular using it. It really isn't as big a deal as some very vocal people seem to think. Depending on where you're going in Mountain View, you might want to stay on it when you get south of San Antonio -- there starts being a bike lane, and its a lot faster than California.

cyclist who doesn't really cycle: If you are cycling on any street, and encounter debris so large that you need to make a major lateral maneuver, you look before moving, just as you would for a lane change or left turn. If you can't make the maneuver, you stop until you can safely do so. This is the same as when you're driving a car, operating a motorcycle, or even driving a horse-drawn cart. There isn't anything particuarly magical about Alma street which makes this approach not work.

What cyclist said above is accurate. Over the years I have observed the passage of larger bits of debris eventually work their way to the side of the street. With everything else a cyclist has to be overly alert about on Alma, those bits can prove fatal. Take El Camino! Boo hoo if there are lights. Y'all want the rights of cars, but you don't want the traffic inconveniences we have to deal with, like stop lights!

So many people have told me that all you need to do is invite the City arborist over for a chat and you will soon discover that the only way he will allow an oak to be taken down is if it is damaging your house (i.e., too late) or the tree is dead, something pretty impossible to detect without expensive core drilling. So most everyone in Palo Alto saves the $200 permit application fee and crosses their fingers that a storm won't take their oak trees down.

It wouldn't have mattered on Emerson Street though. The oak that came down looks like it was on the City right of way, the worst of all worlds for the homeowner. He has no control over the tree but is charged with all its care and maintenance.

Hopefully the former mayor who lives a few doors down and probably voted for the rules that kept that oak tree standing is grateful no one in her neighborhood was harmed by her acts.

The question is whether or not the tree that fell is a city owned tree or a privately owned tree. If the tree belonged to the city, and they have maps showing everyone of their trees, then they are responsible for any damage that their tree caused and for the cleanup.

It is up to the city to be responsible for their own trees. If one should fall because of their negligence, then they are responsible. In my own neighborhood there are 50 year old city trees that are coming to the end of their lives. One fell down blocking the road last fall, fortunately not doing any damage to property. This should show the city that all these similar aged trees are nearing the end of their lives and should be dealt with.

The city is removing the trees on San Antonio because of the potential hazard and the state of the roots. They should also go round residential neighborhoods and do the same.

I got pretty danged tired of cleaning up the magnolia leaves from the City owned trees. We did a low maintenance drought garden because of water concerns and low back problems and those efforts were completely undermined by those leaves. They are thick, don't break down thus making them easy to clean up (you actually have to bend down and pluck them from shrubbery) and fall year round. We finally got some relief when after repeated calls to the City they came out and clipped the trees back a bit.

could it be that drought has caused trees to take up quick storm rains causing collapse? after few dry years maybe sudden deluge soaks up quick adding sudden weight to topple trees? shows how imntyerelated the cosmos is.its all connected