In the latest Around Town column, read about a proposal to loosen the city's leash law, the winners of the inaugural Silicon Valley Photo Contest and a scientific discovery made at the Palo Alto Baylands.
LOOSENING THE LEASH ... Members of Palo Alto's Parks and Recreation Commission offered a treat to local dog owners this week when they proposed loosening the city's leash law. The program, proposed by an ad hoc committee of the parks commission, would allow dogs to run free during designated hours in certain parks. While the city is still considering which parks to include in the new pilot program, Eleanor Pardee and Heritage parks have both been discussed, according to Daren Anderson, a Community Services Department division manager. The city also is still eyeing ways to add new dog parks, particularly in the northern half of the city. Last year, the city added its first dog park north of Oregon Expressway, in Peers Park. While parks commissioners and city staff support building a new dog park in Pardee Park, the project has stalled due to neighbor opposition. Commissioner David Moss said Tuesday that he was concerned about allowing a small group of residents to kill a project that would benefit the entire area. "It's a serious problem if we let five neighbors overrule what 20,000 people in north Palo Alto could benefit from." At the moment, however, the commission is considering a less contentious proposal for the coming year: expanding and improving existing dog parks in Greer and Mitchell parks. The ad hoc committee had also proposed a pilot project that would create off-leash hours at various parks. While Commissioner Keith Reckdahl was concerned about parks getting sullied by dog waste, other commissioners said they support giving the program a shot. They also underscored that the success of the program will largely depend on how well dog owners are able to "police" themselves — whether by chiding or cleaning up after the estimated 3% who don't pick up their dogs' waste.
HIDDEN GEMS ... This week, the inaugural Silicon Valley Photo Contest announced its first-ever winners whose works will soon be on display in Palo Alto. Adults and children were challenged to submit works revolving around the theme, "What I Love About Silicon Valley." In the adult category, J.C. Wang of the Almaden neighborhood in San Jose won over the judges with his work that merges the Milky Way as seen at night and "the silhouette of a futuristic car," according to a press release issued Monday. Los Altos High School's Emily McNally came out on top in the youth category for her slice-of-life-image: a silhouette of two girls walking at Shoreline Park in Mountain View at sunset. The image of a disappearing sun also worked well for Caroline Rose, an adult winner for her shot of a sunset shining over "a very lush green landscape" at Menlo Park's Bedwell Bayfront Park. Rose was one of two winners picked based on a popular vote among the finalists. The other was Milpitas High School's Tran Le, who submitted a photo of a young woman admiring cherry blossoms while sitting on a park bench. All four winners' works will be on display at Rinconada Library next month. The contest's co-sponsors are the Midpen Media Center (which initiated the contest), Palo Alto Chamber of Commerce, Palo Alto City Library and Redwood City-based Sequoia Art Group. See the winning works on the Midpen Media Center’s Facebook page.
TINY DANCERS ... The hunt for wild samples of tiny organisms for research at Stanford University led one scientist to the Palo Alto Baylands, where he discovered a new kind of intercellular communication chronicled in a paper published July 10 in the scientific journal Nature. Using his origami microscope — a Foldscope valued at $1.75 — Manu Prakash watched a single-cell organism, Spirostomum, undergo super speedy contractions. "This is a massive cell but it contracts in less than a blink of an eye, accelerating faster than almost any other single cell. When you aren't expecting it, it's like it disappears," he told Stanford News Service. Prakash, an associate professor in bioengineering, learned through further studies at Stanford that the contraction unfolds in about 5 milliseconds and the cell experiences 14 times the force of gravity. "It's possible this is more universal than we've described so far and is a way many different kinds of organisms communicate," added lead author Arnold Mathijssen, postdoctoral scholar at Stanford's Prakash Lab.
Comments
Palo Verde
on Jul 27, 2019 at 6:10 pm
on Jul 27, 2019 at 6:10 pm
In my experience, scofflaw dog owners walk their dogs off-leash in every park and school playground, at any time or day, law or no law.
Duveneck/St. Francis
on Jul 27, 2019 at 9:00 pm
on Jul 27, 2019 at 9:00 pm
Please do not allow off leash dogs at Eleanor Pardee Park. I think people will let them off a bit more than that - it’s like a slippery slope. I had a grown family member bit by a neighbor’s dog years ago - painful and NOT OK.
The messes of dog filth in our yards and gardens is already too much.
Dogs should NOT have priority over schoolchildren’s health and sanitation at schoolyards and lawns.
In short, curb your dog and keep it in your own home, yard or a dog park. Someone left a blue plastic bag of dog poo on the trail alongside the runway in the Baylands last weekend. Disgusting.
Midtown
on Jul 28, 2019 at 10:37 am
on Jul 28, 2019 at 10:37 am
Please, no more dog poop in parks and school yards used by children. Call animal control if you see dogs in these areas, whether or not an owner is present. Thank you.
Charleston Meadows
on Jul 28, 2019 at 11:49 am
on Jul 28, 2019 at 11:49 am
.... and here come the dog haters. ^^^
XX
This town would be so much better if we had more dogs and fewer7 people.
Community Center
on Jul 28, 2019 at 12:56 pm
on Jul 28, 2019 at 12:56 pm
> Please, no more dog poop in parks and school yards used by children.
^^ Aren't dog owners supposed to pick-up after their pooches?
Someone needs to design a dust buster type device for those too uppity or negligent to do so.
Outdoor cats should also be banned in PA because they often use sandboxes for litter boxes.
The same goes for seagulls & crows that can leave an incredible mess on vehicles parked outdoors.
Animals like people should be trained to go in specific areas.
Registered user
Mountain View
on Jul 28, 2019 at 1:16 pm
Registered user
on Jul 28, 2019 at 1:16 pm
As a lifelong dog owner I love to hear that they will get a chance to run free on grass in open parks. And I agree that there is a high level of responsibility when we’re able to do so. Many years ago we lived near the Rose Garden area and there was a very large group of us who met every evening at Lincoln HS to let our dogs run. We had no complaints because we were vigilant about picking up poop AND we met every Thursday night, made a line and walked the football field and picked up any stray poop we saw, whether it was our dogs’ or not. We earned a reputation for being super responsible and even the animal control patrols would come by and give us thumbs up.
Perhaps if more dog owners grouped together and did this more people would be supportive of letting them run free.
Crescent Park
on Jul 28, 2019 at 1:43 pm
on Jul 28, 2019 at 1:43 pm
Regulations on dog-owners and how they and their dogs behave in public do not in the least need loosening? I realize it is annoying for the responsible dog owners, but the rest of us have no way to tell who they are.
Dogs have really changed a lot since I was a kid and now include deadly weapons, or possibly out of control monsters. Don't let up on the little protections we have today.
Also ... it is not just a leash that is an issue ... it is, can this person control this dog or more than one dog on a leash.
Downtown North
on Jul 28, 2019 at 2:16 pm
on Jul 28, 2019 at 2:16 pm
Palo Alto has too many dog haters and too many irresponsible dog owners.
Things have changed,for example, their is a new group of folks that have basically taken over Seale Park. I can not count how many times they have told us "No dogs allowed!", or they freak out, even though it is perfectly legal to walk your dog on a leash,and have been doing so for 45 years.
What are you supposed to say to that?
It feels like we opened our front door, invited new folks in, then they turned around and kicked us out of our own home.
Registered user
Embarcadero Oaks/Leland
on Jul 29, 2019 at 6:36 am
Registered user
on Jul 29, 2019 at 6:36 am
Totally in support of relaxing leash laws. Palo Alto would be a much better place if it had more dogs and far less people.
South of Midtown
on Jul 29, 2019 at 9:17 am
on Jul 29, 2019 at 9:17 am
Some dogs will chase bicyclists, and a few might bite. It has happened to me (in another town.) Who's gonna pay for the rabies shots?
Midtown
on Jul 29, 2019 at 9:53 am
on Jul 29, 2019 at 9:53 am
If dogs are so much better than people why do they poop and pee on things outside and why do they inbreed? The truth is that since getting rid of my dog, because of less poop and pee in the yard (something few people do), means much less ants, flies, and other insects. No dog food means the rats went away too. For every sincere animal rights activist, I would kindly ask you to come to my house, 'catch' the insects (and rodents) on my property and 'release' them on yours. You know in the name of mother earth and whatnot. You can say it all angry like, "You people person!" you know, like Berny Sanders when he talks bout the Wall Street Bankers, that would be fine with me, and I'll say what a great animal rights person you are, you proved it. and uh, there's more insects over there...
Another Palo Alto neighborhood
on Jul 29, 2019 at 10:25 am
on Jul 29, 2019 at 10:25 am
Posted by Resident, a resident of Downtown North
>> Palo Alto has too many dog haters and too many irresponsible dog owners.
I'm not a "dog hater", but, I am a "dog owner hater." It all happened years ago now and I'm over it. Mostly. But, back in the day, trying to find a park, any park, to practice the sport of the day, baseball, soccer, etc., on a Saturday or Sunday morning, was quite difficult, because of the dog owners. They absolutely would not police each other, and would not prevent their or anyone else's dog, always running loose ("What is a "leash"?), dogs chewing on balls and jumping on kids. Call animal control and the dog owners would behave for about five minutes and then back to the same. Yes, I personally know some people with wonderful, friendly, well-trained dogs. But, a large, visible segment of dog owners are extremely selfish and irresponsible. I don't know what fraction of dog owners they represent, but, they dominate the discussion because they are the problem.
>> Things have changed,for example, their is a new group of folks that have basically taken over Seale Park. I can not count how many times they have told us "No dogs allowed!", or they freak out, even though it is perfectly legal to walk your dog on a leash,and have been doing so for 45 years.
Unfortunately, it seems to be either/or. Because irresponsible dog owners always dominate the scene. Responsible dog owners need to show the rest of us how irresponsible dog owners can be kept under control, so the dogs can be kept under control, including not jumping on kids and stealing and chewing their balls and pooping everywhere.
>> What are you supposed to say to that?
You could explain how, in your park, social pressure keeps the bad-dog-owners under control.
>> It feels like we opened our front door, invited new folks in, then they turned around and kicked us out of our own home.
The analogy doesn't work, because, however well you control and manage your own dog, what people see and remember is the bad owner whose bad dog knocked over their kid while stealing his ball. And, that is if the dog doesn't assault and injure the kid, like one neighbor's dog did to another neighbor's kid years ago.
Greenmeadow
on Jul 29, 2019 at 10:44 am
on Jul 29, 2019 at 10:44 am
How about some simple courtesy? Pick up after your dog. Don't allow your loose dog to run up to dogs that are leashed, ESPECIALLY in an area that requires dogs being leashed. This invites a reaction from the leashed dog who cannot express the body language of greeting a new dog and who cannot escape.
Registered user
Downtown North
on Jul 29, 2019 at 11:17 am
Registered user
on Jul 29, 2019 at 11:17 am
My rule is, if your dog is off leash and comes towards me and my dog, I pick up my little friend and remind you of the law. If we meet again under the same circumstances, I call 329-2413.
Keep the leash laws, fellas.
Although ‘thank you’ to the strapping young lad who kept his behemoth under control (and deftly parried my guy with his foot), when dum-dum bolted from car just as I was strapping him in.
Registered user
Duveneck/St. Francis
on Jul 29, 2019 at 12:04 pm
Registered user
on Jul 29, 2019 at 12:04 pm
I am a long-time dog owner. I strongly support leash laws. My well-loved medium-sized dogs are perfectly happy to have regular walks on a leash. I also support dog parks in neighborhoods within walking distance for dog owners who live there. Enlarging the dog parks in south PA will not solve the problem. It will just put people who want to comply with the law in cars to travel to south PA for a dog park. It will encourage people in north PA who are willing to break the law to set their dogs off leash on school campuses and parks in north PA.
The problem is a growing number of dog owners who simply don't know their dogs well and don't train their dogs well. These are the people who inattentively walk their dogs while pecking at their cell phone. They inattentively let their dogs wander around school campuses and parks pooping everywhere. They are the same people who aren't paying attention when their dogs run up to children and other dogs that may be on leash--clueless that this is threatening to both the other animals and other people. They don't have voice control and yet let their dogs off-leash--which is a danger both to their dog and to others. Stupid. This is how many dogs are hit by cars.
These dog owners are surprisingly many in number. They are the reason we absolutely must have leash laws.
Please put a dog park at that end of town where it is needed. Maintain leash laws so that when a dog behaves in a threatening way but fails in an attempt to bite, people have recourse.
I love dogs, but I really hate the idea that untrained, unsupervised animals should be allowed to run freely and uncontrolled in parks and school playgrounds that are meant for people (especially children) to play. That is not a good idea.
Train your dog. It is not enough to just love your dog. Make sure your dog is well socialized and well controlled when you expose it to other animals and people--for the safety of your dog and everyone else. This is challenging, time-consuming work that takes attention and time. (Like raising a child.) If you can't make time to be an attentive, good dog owner, don't get a dog.
Midtown
on Jul 29, 2019 at 12:32 pm
on Jul 29, 2019 at 12:32 pm
okay, this is an honest question, which some dog firster can answer in the name of my education. I have seen more and more dogs trotted into stores, and onto airplanes. They "emotionally" support you, I'm told. But, if you see a sign that says "No dogs in the sports stadium" for example, yet, you bring your dog right in, anyway, and not even necessarily on a leash, what are you thinking? Is it intentional civil disobedience in the name of social justice? Like Gandhi and MLK, Jr.? In your mind, is that why you do it?
Midtown
on Jul 29, 2019 at 1:06 pm
on Jul 29, 2019 at 1:06 pm
If laws are removed because people break them anyway, what is next? Let's raise the speed limit to 40 and make stopping at red lights optional!
Why not build the dog parks and enforce the laws?
Anyone whose child has run, walked, sat, rolled or cartwheeled in the grass would know the sanitation issue created by dog waste in school and park play fields.
Midtown
on Jul 29, 2019 at 1:25 pm
on Jul 29, 2019 at 1:25 pm
But have you read those bumper stickers they have? 'My dog is smarter (or cleaner) than your toddler'. I don't think they are in a negotiable frame of mind about such responsible civic matters. If you were to ask them to follow such laws, they'd probably sue you for a hate crime. I look at them, and try to keep my distance.
Registered user
Professorville
on Jul 29, 2019 at 2:11 pm
Registered user
on Jul 29, 2019 at 2:11 pm
We have been dog lovers and dog owners since we moved 40+ years ago into our house on Bryant Street just one block from what is now Heritage Park. As previously stated it's not the dogs but the dog owners who are the problem. Dog owners routinely allow their dogs on leashes to relieve themselves in our carefully maintained front yard garden and ivy covered parkway. In addition at least once a week I have to clean up dog fecal matter off the sidewalk in front of my house. My question is, "If this is the behavior owners routinely allow when their dogs are on leash what can we expect when dogs are off leash in a park . . . especially a park like Heritage Park frequented by young children?"
Registered user
Embarcadero Oaks/Leland
on Jul 29, 2019 at 5:31 pm
Registered user
on Jul 29, 2019 at 5:31 pm
A driver running a red light is infinitesimally more dangerous than an off leash dogs. I see red light running pretty much each time I'm anywhere near a Palo Alto intersection, which keeps reenforcing my long held position, based on irrefutable facts, that it is people who need training much more than dogs, and that Palo Alto would be a much nicer place if it had more dogs and much less people.
Midtown
on Jul 29, 2019 at 6:47 pm
on Jul 29, 2019 at 6:47 pm
Dogs are great on the farm ... free to run in the fields and poop where nobody will care. I hate them in town though ... they bark, chase runners, poop and pee on athletic fields, sidewalks, front yards. Whenever you are near a dog off leash you need to literally watch your backside or they may give chase. I don't mind well -behaved dogs ... but with the exception of a few breeds, there is no way to tell what a strange dog will do the first time that you encounter it. The fraction of dog owners that follow the leash laws in our parks/schools seems about the same as the fraction of bicyclists that stop at stop signs around town (low).
Charleston Meadows
on Jul 30, 2019 at 12:31 pm
on Jul 30, 2019 at 12:31 pm
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Adobe-Meadow
on Jul 30, 2019 at 12:46 pm
on Jul 30, 2019 at 12:46 pm
MV adopted a similar program years ago and it's resulted in neighbors coming together in the parks with their dogs to share in conversations with each other, meet new neighbors and generally build solid communities around these parks. Eeww, yuck! Who needs that?!
Seriously, You can either look at what has already factually happened by looking at example cities, or you can be afraid of something someone IMAGINED might happen, but in reality is highly unlikely based on the example cities.
Release the hounds!
Another Palo Alto neighborhood
on Jul 30, 2019 at 1:28 pm
on Jul 30, 2019 at 1:28 pm
Posted by It's already working elsewhere, a resident of Adobe-Meadow
>> MV adopted a similar program years ago and it's resulted in neighbors coming together in the parks with their dogs to share in conversations with each other, meet new neighbors and generally build solid communities around these parks. [..] Seriously, You can either look at what has already factually happened by looking at example cities, or you can be afraid of something someone IMAGINED might happen, but in reality is highly unlikely based on the example cities.
What I have seen constantly over the years is that bad-dog-owners blow-off friendly advice from others, including non-owners and other dog owners alike. I don't know if it really works in MV or not -- but, I doubt it. Because I don't see human nature being any different in MV than it is in PA. If only one out of seven dog owners is a real jerk, that will be plenty to screw it up for everyone. Everyone else likely just suffers in silence. From the original article:
"They also underscored that the success of the program will largely depend on how well dog owners are able to "police" themselves — whether by chiding or cleaning up after the estimated 3% who don't pick up their dogs' waste."
I doubt that the good-owners will be able to effectively police the bad-owners.
Mountain View
on Jul 30, 2019 at 1:49 pm
on Jul 30, 2019 at 1:49 pm
To the point above, again, I can attest that its already working in MV.
Perfection? Nope, but it's working very well.
College Terrace
on Jul 31, 2019 at 2:25 pm
on Jul 31, 2019 at 2:25 pm
Many people are afraid of dogs. Dogs don't always get along w other dogs. Parks are public spaces, for all residents to enjoy - not to avoid because they fear their children or themselves being bitten, or getting caught in the crossfire between two dogs that don't get along.
I love dogs. Dog parks are the appropriate place on city land for dogs to be off leash.
College Terrace
on Jul 31, 2019 at 2:29 pm
on Jul 31, 2019 at 2:29 pm
It's also not fair that I have to fear for my and my dog's safety, walking in a public park, when a random off leash aggressive dog approaches. Will the city pay for the vet bills? Hope so, because I would be glad to sue.
Fairmeadow
on Jul 31, 2019 at 4:49 pm
on Jul 31, 2019 at 4:49 pm
We heard the EXACT same arguments before Mountain View relaxed their leash laws. Even the same threats of law suits. The thing is, YEARS have gone by and it really hasn't been a problem. There are no more fears about what might happen because what actually DID happen was the lack of many issues. Now it's much more of a community benefit considering all the neighbors coming together each night in the park to discuss the stuff going on in the hood :)
I don't think people should worry about what they can think up and realize reality has shown people that it's not an issue once implemented.
We cannot accommodate every individual's fears when we have evidence exemplified in MV that it'll be ok.
Midtown
on Jul 31, 2019 at 6:06 pm
on Jul 31, 2019 at 6:06 pm
I feel sorry for dogs whos' owners know nothing about dog socialization, and project their own fear onto their dogs while depriving it of a natural lifestyle because of all these invented fears of what *might* happen.
Another Palo Alto neighborhood
on Jul 31, 2019 at 6:37 pm
on Jul 31, 2019 at 6:37 pm
I don't own a dog at present, but I grew up in a household with dogs. From my experience there are a couple of things that are worth sharing.
A well exercised dog is a happy dog and a well trained dog is a happy dog. Exercise and training are things that make a big difference in the welfare of dogs and how they interact with others, both human and other dogs. A well exercised dog means a dog that is given exercise at least twice a day as well as freedom to roam. A sizeable back yard is necessary, but not the only exercise a dog needs. A dog needs to be able to run at its fastest speed rather than just walk to heel. A dog needs to be able to fetch a ball or a stick. A dog needs to be exercised to the extent that it is tired and in need of a nap when he is finished exercising.
A well trained dog is obedient to commands, will come when its owner calls its name and will obey commands such as sit, stay, wait, come. A well trained dog will be socialized with other dogs and with strangers. A well trained dog will need to sniff and smell and leave its scent so that other dogs in the area can identify the scent. Many will think this is "peeing" but it is necessary for dogs to leave their scent as well as sniff for other dogs scents. The places the dogs do this are usually water hydrants or trees, fence posts or other "boundary" type objects. Most dogs peeing on grass are emptying their bladder rather than leaving their scent.
Understanding dogs is something that a dog owner needs to do. If they are not prepared to give a dog the exercise it needs, they should question their ownership of the pet. A daily short walk is not enough exercise even for the smallest dog. I would also say that in my opinion a dog being exercised by a person with more than one dog on a leash is not sufficient either.
Just from my experience these things are necessary to keep a dog healthy and happy.
Barron Park
on Aug 1, 2019 at 4:37 pm
on Aug 1, 2019 at 4:37 pm
Too many people in Palo Alto are certain that their dog must run free in parks, on streets, and anywhere else. Please keep to the present leash law that all dogs must be on a leash everywhere in the City except in special fenced yards (park dog areas).
Your dog is no better than any other and many of us do not appreciate the poop or dogs running up to them.
Just remember some of us are tiny or old and cannot withstand a dog bounding up to them.
Midtown
on Aug 4, 2019 at 2:29 pm
on Aug 4, 2019 at 2:29 pm
@ C. Walters
Very few of us non dog owners hate dogs. What we dislike is the constant need to clean up after your dog etc.
Yes most dog owners claim they are responsible yet, we keep find your pooches leavings everywhere.
Maybe I just don't want my kids to play in an area you dog just peed
Also, I realize you don't want a bag a poo in you pocket till you get home, but stop dumping them in peoples recycling bin. We don't want to have to smell it after its baked in there for a week any more than you do.
Every owner act as if their fur baby is some sort of AKC certified pet therapy dog and would not touch a soul, but how am I supposed to know that?
Keep the existing leash laws.
Barron Park
on Aug 4, 2019 at 6:30 pm
on Aug 4, 2019 at 6:30 pm
Good Grief !
The article could be about a Dog who cured cancer or a Dog who eliminated all nuclear weapons from the planet, but we'd still have to read all the Dog Haters posting coments about dog poop in their trash cans. WHat a town !
Adobe-Meadow
on Aug 5, 2019 at 6:39 am
on Aug 5, 2019 at 6:39 am
Since I can walk my leashed dog anywhere in the park, do you think he won't pee or poop because he's on a leash?
My son actually asks to go the a certain park in mountain view because he'll be able to interact with off leash dogs.
Clearly it's impossible to suit all desires of the community wrt this situation, so a compromise looks to be the best solution, like what happened in MV.
Midtown
on Aug 5, 2019 at 10:58 am
on Aug 5, 2019 at 10:58 am
Aren't cats just better? smarter, cleaner, can entertain themselves, so less needy? Curing cancer? nuclear wha? you mean, those animals who great other dogs ...nose to rear end? Let's stay on planet earth, please. Most dog-owners just like telling someone else what to do, and if it can't be other humans, dogs will 'obey'. Right?
Green Acres
on Aug 5, 2019 at 12:07 pm
on Aug 5, 2019 at 12:07 pm
Hi Real slim
Not sure to that but maybe so.
I’m too liking it and enjoy my cats.
But pooping universal to that.
Green Acres
on Aug 5, 2019 at 12:18 pm
on Aug 5, 2019 at 12:18 pm
Sorry for my using
Google translate
College Terrace
on Aug 5, 2019 at 12:42 pm
on Aug 5, 2019 at 12:42 pm
Birds are the best !
Love our Parrots
Hate cats. Cats are evil things.
Dogs are drooley.
Midtown
on Aug 5, 2019 at 1:46 pm
on Aug 5, 2019 at 1:46 pm
well, at least we can all agree dog-owners are the worst. Does any other need a support animal?
Midtown
on Aug 5, 2019 at 5:06 pm
on Aug 5, 2019 at 5:06 pm
Yes ....
“An emotional support animal (ESA), assistance animal, or support animal, is a companion animal that is intended to provide some benefit for a person disabled by a mental health condition or emotional disorder. Emotional support animals are typically dogs, but are sometimes cats or other animals: they are intended to assist persons suffering psychological disabilities that substantially interfere with major life activities, such as anxiety disorder, major depressive disorder, or panic attacks.”
Are you saying that you are against this ?
Midtown
on Aug 5, 2019 at 8:11 pm
on Aug 5, 2019 at 8:11 pm
Let's put it this way, Chris. Do you honestly believe that everyone who uses a DMV placard is 'disabled'? Do you really believe everyone who brings a dog onto an airplane is "disabled"? Also, have you really seen a pet cat on an airplane? Finally, if I said yes to your final question, even as a joke, would you ...self-combust ?
Crescent Park
on Aug 6, 2019 at 6:04 am
on Aug 6, 2019 at 6:04 am
Sounds like a great idea. When does the off-leash program start?
Another Palo Alto neighborhood
on Aug 6, 2019 at 11:43 am
on Aug 6, 2019 at 11:43 am
Posted by Chris, a resident of Midtown
>> Are you saying that you are against this ?
I'm against 50-125+ lb pit bulls, Dobermans, Rottweilers, German (and other) Shepherds, Malamutes, Chow Chows, etc etc etc, running loose in the parks, no matter how freaking friendly they are, and, relative to this issue, regardless of their emotional support status. Dangerous animals need to be on-leash, regardless of ESA status.
Mountain View
on Aug 6, 2019 at 12:30 pm
on Aug 6, 2019 at 12:30 pm
I don't own a dog but I do go to an off leash park in mtn view to get my dog fix from other's dogs. It's awesome, I bring small treats and we've all come to know each other over the years + the dogs are all so happy well behaved.
@Anon: To put your mind at ease about this issue, you really should come out to Mtn View and see for yourself.
It's nothing at all like situation you've imagined in your mind then described to us.
Yah, come to Mtn View, you'll see it's really fine and builds great community when people talk face to face. It adds a nice value to the neighborhood.
Registered user
Downtown North
on Aug 7, 2019 at 12:25 am
Registered user
on Aug 7, 2019 at 12:25 am
Dog owners who say their dogs are too good for a leash law are like gun owners who say they need guns for protection or are entitled to be part of a militia.
Pretty soon we will find out that a Libertarian cult has bought a few blocks of Ventura and don't want the police to come around at all -- I thought of that one while driving home from the new Quentin Tarantino movie -- the hero of which of course is a dog.
Adobe-Meadow
on Aug 7, 2019 at 9:52 am
on Aug 7, 2019 at 9:52 am
We have a town right next to us that has had relaxed leash laws for years and years now. I wonder why the issues that some keep imagining might happen in PA have not happened there.
It's working great. If not we would read on thjis very site about all about the savaging going on by all these dangerous animals terrorizing the parks of mountain view ;)
Crescent Park
on Aug 8, 2019 at 5:16 pm
on Aug 8, 2019 at 5:16 pm
cvvhrn:
> Also, I realize you don't want a bag a poo in you pocket till you get home,
> but stop dumping them in peoples recycling bin. We don't want to have to
> smell it after its baked in there for a week any more than you do.
Wow, ain't that the truth. They are the ones who chose to have a dog, they
are the ones who need to manage its externalities, not dumping it on their
neighbors when we are not looking.
What kind of miscreant jerks think it is OK to drop their dog poop into a garbage
can other people pay for and have to smell? How inconsiderate.
Just let me catch a few of you so I can follow you home and leave my garbage
in your cans and see how much you appreciate it or think it is OK?
???? Will the police do anything if we submit video of someone dropping
???? their dog poop into a garbage bin not their own?
I feel sorry for doggies that have low-lives like that for owners.
Adobe-Meadow
on Aug 8, 2019 at 5:34 pm
on Aug 8, 2019 at 5:34 pm
Most owners are religious about picking it up but we all see the evidence that a few bad owners leave. Most people stop at red lights, but the few make it seem like everyone is doing it. I wish everyone obeyed laws. Still, no reason not to relax the leash laws. Dogs poop on or off leash.
Professorville
on Aug 9, 2019 at 2:37 am
on Aug 9, 2019 at 2:37 am
Coming from Europe none of you seem to appreciate the hand-warming properties of a freshly filled poo bag. But if your dog is off its lead (what is this leash thing?) you don't know if poo has happened unless you watch him like a hawk - ie not glued to your phone.
Another Palo Alto neighborhood
on Aug 9, 2019 at 10:35 am
on Aug 9, 2019 at 10:35 am
Posted by Dog Bogart, a resident of Mountain View
on Aug 6, 2019 at 12:30 pm
>> @Anon: To put your mind at ease about this issue, you really should come out to Mtn View and see for yourself.
It's nothing at all like situation you've imagined in your mind then described to us.
>> Yah, come to Mtn View, you'll see it's really fine and builds great community when people talk face to face. It adds a nice value to the neighborhood.
I don't have to go to Mountain View to see it because I can see what happens right here. Bad owners with big or aggressive or overly-friendly/untrained dogs to to PA parks all the time and let their dogs run off leash. People with small children leave. Older and/or frail people will leave. People who don't like to be slobbered on or growled at will leave. So, there's your "nice value".
Barron Park
on Aug 9, 2019 at 10:47 am
on Aug 9, 2019 at 10:47 am
So if it IS a problem in Palo Alto parks but it ISN'T a problem in MV parks, I suggest we look to model MV's plan to try and improve Palo Alto's situation.
That's a win win for everyone.
Barron Park
on Aug 9, 2019 at 11:04 am
on Aug 9, 2019 at 11:04 am
My area just has community cans. Everyone just leaves the cans on the street all the time and I just toss my dogs poop in the closest black (trash) can. The neighbor across the street spaces their cans about 8 feet apart so no one parks in front of their house. The guy on the corner puts his out into the street so people have to slow down to make the tighter turn. It works out pretty well. Not sure why you all can’t find available cans to toss your poop in.
Adobe-Meadow
on Aug 9, 2019 at 11:24 am
on Aug 9, 2019 at 11:24 am
@Sandy, most take care of the poop religiously, it's just the bad ones that get noticed, like red light runners.
Sometimes people like to exaggerate how bad things are or might be to try and support their position.
Another Palo Alto neighborhood
on Aug 9, 2019 at 5:11 pm
on Aug 9, 2019 at 5:11 pm
Posted by Solution, a resident of Barron Park
>> So if it IS a problem in Palo Alto parks but it ISN'T a problem in MV parks, I suggest we look to model MV's plan to try and improve Palo Alto's situation. That's a win win for everyone.
Sure, but, perhaps someone from MV can explain why my concerns will not be relevant. If the answer is, "All the parents/children, elderly, and non-dog-lovers leave" then that isn't a "win win for everyone". I fail to understand why there are no dog bad-owners in MV parks. It could be that people who don't like the situation just stay away from the parks-- how do we know that is not the case? For the record, I much prefer designated, fenced dog parks.
Old Palo Alto
on Aug 10, 2019 at 4:09 pm
on Aug 10, 2019 at 4:09 pm
Just a reminder to a lot of you dog owners, you are not being a good citizen or taking care of your dog's poop when to drop it in someone else's garbage or yard-waste container and make it their problem.
Old Palo Alto
on Aug 10, 2019 at 4:27 pm
on Aug 10, 2019 at 4:27 pm
Anonymous a resident of Duveneck/St. Francis said
> Someone left a blue plastic bag of dog poo on the trail alongside the runway in the Baylands last weekend. Disgusting.
That is so common lately all the way from Palo Alto to Mountain View, but more in Palo Alto. It is also common that some dog-owners seem to do that in the town when no one is looking, if it is garbage day they will leave a stink bomb in other people's waste containers, if not they just drop it in the road verge.
In the Baylands a lot of owners will just walk their dogs a bit off the trail and not bother to pick it up at all, as you said bag it and drop the bag by the side of the road for someone else to take care of.
In terms of having dogs on leashes, often in the Baylands people remove their dog's leashes and are quite aggressive about it when you mention it to them.
I often see people walking dogs they could not control if they had to, as well as dogs on ridiculously long leashes. Dogs at the end of a 20-30 foot long leash cannot be controlled.
It is so bad in the Baylands now that they are bringing their miscreant behavior into town like it is OK. I'd rather have dogs disallowed out there altogether or only allowed in one fenced in area where they can be watched. It's not fair to those who do clean up after their dogs.
Duveneck/St. Francis
on Aug 10, 2019 at 8:36 pm
on Aug 10, 2019 at 8:36 pm
“you are not being a good citizen or taking care of your dog's poop when to drop it in someone else's garbage”
Baloney.
It’s trash.
If you leave your can in the road it’s contents are public property.
If you see trash anywhere, pick it up and put it in the nearest trash can on the street.
Palo Verde
on Aug 10, 2019 at 11:24 pm
on Aug 10, 2019 at 11:24 pm
>> If you leave your can in the road its contents are public property.
That explains why cars get broken into when they are left on the curb.
Old Palo Alto
on Aug 11, 2019 at 3:25 am
on Aug 11, 2019 at 3:25 am
What Don "Behind the keyboard tough-guy wanna-be" is saying is that he will talk tough online about putting stuff in other people's trash can, but it seems like he'd be too afraid to do it and take the chance of getting caught. Maybe he has a bone-spur.
Besides the argument he makes about the contents of the trash left out by the garbage subscriber are correct, but it is not legal to put stuff into the trash can someone else is paying for. Don is too simple to understand the difference.
Another Palo Alto neighborhood
on Aug 11, 2019 at 7:23 am
on Aug 11, 2019 at 7:23 am
According to Greenwaste our cans do not belong to us and we are not entitled to the same can each week. Several years ago there was an incident in our neighborhood where one neighbor kept washing can each week and painted house number on said can. One week another neighbor took in the "wrong" can. You can imagine the consternation of the neighbor who had to accept the smelly, dirty can. Greenwaste were contacted about ownership of cans and they stated that they own all the cans and residents have no rights to the same can each week.
I suspect that they would agree that a can on the side of the road (particularly when full) can be used by anyone since the cans do not belong to an address.
Old Palo Alto
on Aug 11, 2019 at 8:51 am
on Aug 11, 2019 at 8:51 am
Resident a resident of Another Palo Alto neighborhood, that's interesting, because after my black garbage container broke, Greenwaste brought me a replacement and the first thing the Greenwaste guy who carried around some large pens with him was to wrote my house address on it as I have seen on many others.
Your third-hand story you relate makes no sense, because after all the cans are often of different sizes, so you cannot just grab someone else's cans and everything is good. Also the cans have individual serial numbers printed on them so they can be identified. Also the company needs to be able to identify if a customer is throwing away something they should not be in a given can. Perhaps your third-hand information on can ownership was no good, or biased by a neighbor for their own reasons, or just the result of a Greenwaste agent who did not want to take ownership of what could be a thorny issue.
Maybe Greenwaste could respond here and let us know for sure what the official policy is or point to a link in their website that explains this would be even better?
However, I don't see where it matters who owns the bin, no one else has the right to use up space or dump garbage in someone else's paid-for container, and when you walk down the block or onto another street you know it is not your bin you are dropping your "doggy-stuff" into, not to mention it is just the wrong, immoral thing to do, and being a nasty neighbor, not to mention those who support and defend this kind of rudeness. If one cannot abide by the not very stringent requirements of having a dog, maybe they should not be a dog owner.
I am so surprised at the bellicosity with which some people want to foist their dog waste onto other people and think it is fine. Give your dogs to people who do not mind taking responsibility for them for Pete's sake!
Professorville
on Aug 11, 2019 at 11:09 am
on Aug 11, 2019 at 11:09 am
It’s pretty simple.
The trash contractor owned the cans.
The property owner rents the cans.
The property owner can (and should) take the can onto their private property and place their refuse in them per sorting guidelines.
If someone comes on your private property it is trespassing.
When the property owner puts the cans on the street for pickup, they are putting the contractor owned cans on public property. The contents are no longer the property of the original owner. The police can search your can without warrant. You have no expectation of privacy. The courts have ruled on this.
Trash placed in any trash can on public property IS the intent of the trash service. If you see trash on public property, you should pick it up and put it in the nearest can on public property
To maintain control of the contents of a trash can, the property owner must maintain it in their private property, and the trespassing laws apply. Otherwise, the property owner has no recourse.
Professorville
on Aug 11, 2019 at 11:15 am
on Aug 11, 2019 at 11:15 am
@ musical”
“ cars get broken into when they are left on the curb.
Broken into ?
File a complaint with the police for breaking and entering.
Was anything stolen after the break in ?
Old Palo Alto
on Aug 11, 2019 at 12:37 pm
on Aug 11, 2019 at 12:37 pm
>> Law a resident of Professorville says It’s pretty simple.
Yes, it is pretty simple to call yourself Professor Law and make up stuff.
>> The contents are no longer the property of the original owner. The police can search your can without warrant. You have no expectation of privacy. The courts have ruled on this.
Does not bear on dumping trash in someone else's container they have to pay for and are forced byh law to set on the curb. What you are saying is stupid and ridiculous on the face of it, yet you change your name can keep repeating it. What's next, Perry Mason? Brett Kavanaugh?
A simple reductio ad absurdem should tell you are full of what you want to put in other people's property. You are implying that you, or others can walk by and fill up someone's whole can and deny them the use of something they pay for. Someone will call you on it and not be polite about it.
Old Palo Alto
on Aug 11, 2019 at 12:43 pm
on Aug 11, 2019 at 12:43 pm
Professor Law, when you are parking your car at the curb be sure to keep your convertible top up and the windows tight or someone walking their dog by might mistake it for a trash can. Even then according to your philosophy and your peculiar notion of being a good neighbor you might get a present left on your hood.
another community
on Aug 11, 2019 at 12:57 pm
on Aug 11, 2019 at 12:57 pm
“ when you are parking your car at the curb be sure to keep your convertible top up and the windows tight or someone walking their dog by might mistake it for a trash can. “
“A simple reductio ad absurdem “
Ibid your honor
Adobe-Meadow
on Aug 12, 2019 at 2:31 pm
on Aug 12, 2019 at 2:31 pm
[Post removed]
Menlo Park
on Aug 13, 2019 at 7:03 pm
on Aug 13, 2019 at 7:03 pm
Please don't do this. As a person who has a dog that doesn't like other dogs, I worry. She loves humans, but she reacts poorly to other dogs approaching her. Either way, I'm totally fine keeping my dog on a leash and maintaining control of the situation. I just don't want anything bad to happen if other people may not be as vigilant and their dogs are curious. It makes me very nervous.
Old Palo Alto
on Aug 15, 2019 at 2:41 pm
on Aug 15, 2019 at 2:41 pm
LB, you know this situation is going to happen sooner or later if you take your dog out ... you are telling us that now. The onus ought to be on you, and other owners of problematic dogs. Part of being able to control your dog in public is being able to train your dog not to respond or provoke situations that you would rather blame on other dogs.
Socialize your animal or do not take it out. If you do and damages occur you are telling us now that you are liable because you are willfully ignoring a danger. Do you disagree?
Midtown
on Aug 15, 2019 at 2:55 pm
on Aug 15, 2019 at 2:55 pm
Dog loving person, please keep your private life private.
I don't think that was what LB was saying at all. I picture my own experience. My dog was very violently attacked by a bigger dog who was off the leash and the owner could offer nothing except to say 'I don't know what to do!' as her angry/psycho Cujo took multiple kicks from me without even flinching. When I could, I frantically scooped up my small dog and retreated over Middlefield where a passing motorist almost ran into us, which would likely have killed us both. No amount of training of my dog would have helped that situation, which will occur more often not less, if you have your way.
Old Palo Alto
on Aug 15, 2019 at 4:30 pm
on Aug 15, 2019 at 4:30 pm
Slim, you misreading comments here. That is exactly what I was saying. Go back and read LB's post, LB said their dog does not respond well to others ... the example of just what you say happened to your own dog and yourself. Now go and read what I said. I won't hold my breath waiting for an apology or trying to figure out what "keep your private life private" means, but I don't think we disagree, unless you are just barking for a fight.