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Why so many expulsions of EPA kids from Carlmont?

Original post made by Travis Ramos, East Palo Alto, on Aug 11, 2010

How come vice principal Mr. Crame at Carlmont High School is still working there? Last year he expelled over twenty students all but one or two were male Hispanics from East Palo Alto. How can this happen. Where is the news stations, the people of our town. I have three kids who have been there and I didn't like a lot of the lack of pride the school has for the large amount of kids we send there from our town. When do we get to see the true numbers from lats year of expelled students and how many were from East Palo Alto? This needs to be looked into ASAP! Why are our Mexican boys being kicked out?

Comments (22)

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Posted by Walter_E_Wallis
a resident of Midtown
on Aug 11, 2010 at 3:20 pm

Walter_E_Wallis is a registered user.

[Post removed by Palo Alto Online staff.]


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Posted by Walter_E_Wallis
a resident of Midtown
on Aug 12, 2010 at 1:32 am

Walter_E_Wallis is a registered user.

So meaningful discussion of an intemperate accusation of a public official is off limits? Then why allow the accusation to stand? This IS a forum, is it not?


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Posted by sara
a resident of Another Palo Alto neighborhood
on Aug 12, 2010 at 2:00 am

Travis: Do you know the reasons the students were expelled? It probably relates to their behavior. They would not be expelled for simply being Mexican. Get real.

These school districts are doing EPA parents a favor by allowing their children to attend their schools. Palo Alto schools are overcrowded and EPA children are still allowed to gain a first-class education in Palo Alto while non-minorities who cannot afford to live in Palo Alto cannot attend Palo Alto schools. Where is your gratitude?


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Posted by don't believe it.
a resident of Greater Miranda
on Aug 12, 2010 at 5:44 am

We need to remember that behaviors define people, not color. Get the chips off our shoulders and look to our behaviors....for example, how many "rappers" would have been expelled from high school for unacceptable behaviors and language?

get real, get the chip of our shoulders, and look within. I don't believe for one second that this vice principle is a "racist".


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Posted by Walter_E_Wallis
a resident of Midtown
on Aug 12, 2010 at 5:56 am

Walter_E_Wallis is a registered user.

This is one more example of the foolishness of Tinsley. Generations of non-whites have been taught their second class stature by virtue of having to leave their community to get an education. Closing Ravenswood [my daughter was a graduate of the last Ravenswood class] was a slap at all minorities.


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Posted by Crescent Park Dad
a resident of Crescent Park
on Aug 12, 2010 at 11:16 am

I am not a fan of Tinsley - but it should be pointed out that EPA is part of the Seqouia HS district...so the fact that the boys in question went to Carlmont has nothing to do with Tinsley.


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Posted by Walter_E_Wallis
a resident of Midtown
on Aug 12, 2010 at 2:38 pm

Walter_E_Wallis is a registered user.

Without Tinsley Ravenswood would have been rebuilt.


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Posted by P.A. Pop
a resident of Fairmeadow
on Aug 12, 2010 at 10:59 pm

As usual, all of those making comments don't take the poster who suggests that racism is a problem in our schools seriously. A couple even seem to suggest that EPA high school students should be grateful to be offered any education at all. (They should be thrilled that they are forced to take buses to M.A., Woodside or Carlmont, their district schools??)
Just as with the achievement gap, statistics of who gets expelled, test scores, etc. only reflect the problems and inequities. If the majority who are expelled are Latinos, it doesn't necessarily mean that the vice-principal is biased; it could mean that more Latino males are getting into trouble at Carlmont. If that's true, the administration and teachers need to reflect on what's wrong and what they can do about it.


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Posted by Walter_E_Wallis
a resident of Midtown
on Aug 12, 2010 at 11:47 pm

Walter_E_Wallis is a registered user.

POP - My Company Commander in Basic Training in 1949 was what was referred to back then as Mexican. At our initial formation he noted two recruits with the Pachuko tattoo. He proceeded to place them on notice that he would tolerate none of their gang crap, and that he would be watching them and the first time he caught any gang action he would expedite their return to civilian life.
It is not racist to be a culturist, and there has been a pattern of Ravenswood boys self segregating, marking turf and behavior that is inimical to education. Reflect on what's wrong? Everybody knows what's wrong but to paraphrase Goldwater, None Dare Call It Culture.
Perhaps "God" will forgive liberals for trashing the education of three generations of EPA boys, but judicious folk will not.


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Posted by Don't Believe It
a resident of Meadow Park
on Aug 13, 2010 at 6:38 am

[Post removed by Palo Alto Online staff.]


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Posted by Walter_E_Wallis
a resident of Midtown
on Aug 13, 2010 at 10:15 am

Walter_E_Wallis is a registered user.

So all cultures are the same?


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Posted by Crescent Park Dad
a resident of Crescent Park
on Aug 13, 2010 at 2:19 pm

Ravenswood closed in 1976. San Carlos HS closed in 1982. Tinsley didn't come into effect until 1986.

You and I both know that the SUHSD trustees would have rebuilt/re-opened SCHS before considering Ravenswood.


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Posted by Mom
a resident of another community
on Aug 13, 2010 at 11:50 pm

PA Pop:

Re your comment: "more Latino males are getting into trouble at Carlmont. . . administration and teachers need to reflect on what's wrong and what they can do about it."

People expect too much from schools. When there are dispruptive children, it affects the rest of the students' learning. It's not fair to the majority to give special attention to the disruptive kids. There are issues with the families and the parenting of these disruptive students. Good behavior and emphasis on academics comes from the family lives. Are they harmonious? Is there respect? Is there love? Do the parents help them with their homework?

Why are the children of immigrant Asians doing so well in academics when some of their parents cannot help them with their schoolwork? Success in school begins in the home.


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Posted by Outside Observer
a resident of another community
on Aug 13, 2010 at 11:56 pm

"Why are the children of immigrant Asians doing so well in academics when some of their parents cannot help them with their schoolwork?"

Why? It's like Walter said. It's cultural.


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Posted by Don't Believe It
a resident of Meadow Park
on Aug 14, 2010 at 8:18 am

Good grief...quoting from Thomas Sowell, a great economist and philosopher of race-based issues, is now "deletable"?

Let me try again.
Web Link On education of minorities being made worse in the last 40 years.

Web Link on the "racism" card...yawn.

Read anything by this guy, and start waking up. I won't bother quoting from his writings.

Only because race seems to matter to some people, ( I won't say who) on the belief that only people of color can comment on "color" policies, let me refute the vicious rumor I have now read in several "letters to the editor" pages ( I fail to understand how any Editor can let such an egregious accusation stand) that this guy is a an "old white guy". No, he is an old black guy.

Bottom line, cultural or not, ( which is what I got deleted for last time, I believe, for daring to suggest there are certain culturally acceptable behaviors in certain sub-cultures that cause behaviors that cause being expelled..not getting or keeping a job...etc..but I won't suggest that this time), behaviors matter.

Behave respectfully to others, treat others politely, and you will do fine.


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Posted by Walter_E_Wallis
a resident of Midtown
on Aug 14, 2010 at 10:17 am

Walter_E_Wallis is a registered user.

Push day was justified in the 30s. Not any more. When the fire is out you don't continue hosing down cold ashes.


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Posted by Walter_E_Wallis
a resident of Midtown
on Aug 15, 2010 at 8:57 am

Walter_E_Wallis is a registered user.

Those black men who stood up to armed Klansmen are to be celebrated. Those now who pull the tough guy crap, knowing charges of racism disarm their opponents, are cowards.


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Posted by Huh?
a resident of Another Palo Alto neighborhood
on Aug 15, 2010 at 1:13 pm

Where do expelled students go? To another unsuspecting school? I know of an EPA student expelled from our middle school. He disrupted class every day.


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Posted by T. Ramos
a resident of East Palo Alto
on Aug 17, 2010 at 6:05 pm

You are missing what I am saying. This is just one vice principal of three. There was more than twenty Hispanic boys expelled and JUST TWO other students who were NOT Hispanic expelled by just one man. My son's girlfriend says a "white" baseball player got caught with a lot of pot and was not expelled and stayed on the baseball team. We deserve to see the numbers. Just because we are from EPA they think it's ok to leave us out. There are three other schools in the same district, what are the chances that they had more than twenty male Hispanics from our town? This needs to be looked at, NOW!


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Posted by Walter_E_Wallis
a resident of Midtown
on Aug 18, 2010 at 4:56 am

Walter_E_Wallis is a registered user.

The performance of any public official is up for discussion, but don't play the numbers game unless you are prepared to use ALL the numbers.


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Posted by Huh?
a resident of Another Palo Alto neighborhood
on Aug 18, 2010 at 9:10 am

Travis, you never answered the question: What did these students do to get expelled? I think the vice principal is the only one of three who is brave enough to confront the students. I salute the man! Travis, if you really care, do your own work and find out what these students did to get expelled. And don't ask the students themselves - they might not tell the truth. When you are certain it is racism, go find a lawyer to publicize it. Just screaming racism with no data is not going to get you any attention. There are still plenty of Hispanics at Carlmont who have not been expelled. If there is no reason to expel them, they don't get expelled!

Regarding the Caucasian baseball player with pot, he is probably an excellent baseball player who has coaches who want to keep him on the team. If he were Hispanic and a great player, they would keep him on the team also. Great athletes are granted more leeway.


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Posted by Don't Believe It
a resident of Green Acres
on Aug 18, 2010 at 4:28 pm

Travis..there are numbers..and then there are numbers.

What is the percent of Hispanics at Carlmont? What are the rules that the expelled ones broke? What percent of hispanics who break the rules are NOT expelled versus "other colors" who break the rules and aren't expelled?( btw I am hispanic and WHITE, so the entire idea that hispanic means BROWN is racist)

FYI, if you want to start looking at numbers, you have to look at ALL the numbers.

A good one to start learning how to think about numbers from is Thomas Sowell. I recommend any of his books, but the one that might interest you, for just "in general" thinking skills on race, is a book called White Liberals and Black Rednecks.

There is much more at work in these scenarios than simply "these guys were brown and got expelled"...


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